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830 and MonoPoly Thread

830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Number41 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:50 pm

Has anyone tried doing any stitching with MonoPoly on the 830?

I was doing some invisible applique work this evening and ran into some serious problems. I had it working a few times but each time I got it stitching right, the set up prior took about 30 min. The automatic needle threader wants nothing to do with MonoPoly (Superior Brand) thread and I keep getting the thread break error (that little picture with the thread breaking off the spool). I set my tension the way it was recommended and got it working a few times but still had some issues.

Then, I tried rethreading again and somehow the thread got stuck inside all the gears located on the top half of the machine. Grrr..... :x Now I have to take the darn thing to my dealer because I fear pulling it out and possibly breaking something mechanical or breaking the thread and having it spring back inside the gears.

Sorry for all the moaning and groaning, I am just frusterated. :cry: Is anyone out there a Bernina Educator or has anyone had positive results using MonoPoly thread with the 830??

Maria
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Postby pamo65 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:25 pm

Monopoly must be on a horizontal thread holder. Upright or vertical cone holders cause major breakage.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby cblong03 » Sun May 20, 2012 6:54 am

Number41 wrote:Has anyone tried doing any stitching with MonoPoly on the 830?

I was doing some invisible applique work this evening and ran into some serious problems. I had it working a few times but each time I got it stitching right, the set up prior took about 30 min. The automatic needle threader wants nothing to do with MonoPoly (Superior Brand) thread and I keep getting the thread break error (that little picture with the thread breaking off the spool). I set my tension the way it was recommended and got it working a few times but still had some issues.

Then, I tried rethreading again and somehow the thread got stuck inside all the gears located on the top half of the machine. Grrr..... :x Now I have to take the darn thing to my dealer because I fear pulling it out and possibly breaking something mechanical or breaking the thread and having it spring back inside the gears.

Sorry for all the moaning and groaning, I am just frusterated. :cry: Is anyone out there a Bernina Educator or has anyone had positive results using MonoPoly thread with the 830??

Maria


Ok, so I'm a few years late with a reply, but my 820 was in and out of the shop from the end of March and all through April for just this problem. I researched it on Yahoo groups (for the 820/830) and brought the solution to my LQS repair man. On the "older" 820s (I'm assuming the same is true for the 830), there are rivets on the back of the bobbin case stopper (whatever that is), which catch the very fine MonoPoly. Bernina was aware of the problem and fixed it on the newer machines. The repair man finally replaced the bobbin case stopper and made sure to seal anything on the back, which could possible catch (just in case). I was thrilled when I could finally finish my micro-stippling on a project (it had sewed fine for a few hours one day, before the catching started). Hope this helps anyone else with this problem. Beth in AZ
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Sun May 20, 2012 7:40 am

I'm not having any problems with my invisible thread (I've been using YLI) on my 830 while doing invisible applique stitches. I do thread automatically without problem but if you need to thread manually because this thread ends up in the intake area when threading with the automatic threader, no problem. All you have to do is cut the thread at the top, use your multifunction tool to pop open the case and then pull out the piece of thread that went upwards when you were threading. When you thread manually, you must touch the icon with a hand and a needle on the screen of your machine because that will ensure that the thread is being taken in by the uptake lever. Then you push the threader button (same one you touch to automatically thread your machine but because you touched the hand/needle icon on your screen, the automatic threader will not activate), then thread your machine manually.

You definitely do not want to use the automatic thread cutter with Monopoly--a small piece gets stuck and falls into your bobbin case, it cut get stuck in the gears. I went through this with my dealer a few weeks ago and she advises against cutting invisible thread with the thread cutter for that reason.

As for my tension settings on stitch #1331, I use 1.75. I also use Bottom Line (60 wt) thread in the bobbin. I also use a slower speed when using this specialty thread.

If you get thread stuck in the bobbin case and around it, you really have to get it ALL out. Otherwise, you wil
l add garble upon garble when you start stitching again. When you think you have all the thread out, rethread your bobbin. If the bobbin is not rotating with ease as you pull the bobbin thread toward the cutter, then you know you have more junk in your bobbin threading area that needs to be cleaned out.

Hope this helps.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Reetzbobeetz » Sun May 20, 2012 8:49 am

Renata, as you know I do not have a Bernina but I will certainly take your advice about not using the thread cutter while using mono-poly thread. I didn't know this, so thank you for making me aware of it. I also use YLI mono-poly with Bottom Line in the bobbin and find it works really well. :D
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Sun May 20, 2012 9:24 am

I'm actually doing so invisible applique as we speak (on my Sedona Star), well, before I came back to the computer... :) I forgot to put Bottom Line in the bobbin and left my usual Aurifil 50 wt color 2370 (a la Edyta Sitar) that I usually use for piecing. Guess what? The result looks even better! Go figure... :o
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby heartnsoulquilts » Sun May 20, 2012 11:47 am

Renata, this is interesting to me right now, because I have just recently gotten started on my Sedona Star (a bit late but oh well!). I am making the little circles that go around the pieced ring from Month one. I am making them by cutting out 1 1/4" circles of Stable Stuff and then using a 1 3/4" circle of fabric around it. Using a running stitch which is then pulled up snug, I then have my little circles nice and round and a bit puffy. I am not using fusible on them nor raw edge.

So, the other day I did a test to see if I liked the invisible machine zigzag or a blanket stitch around them. I used a tiny zigzag - about 1mm wide x 1mm long with Auriful 50 cotton mako in the bobbin. I lowered the top tension to about 2. It stitched fine on my Bernina 153 however, I am not sure I like the look. The bite of the zigzag was tiny and even, and no bobbin thread pulled to the front. But all I saw along the edge of the fabric circle were holes!

I also tested sewing with a blanket stitch for a decorative look. I used a variegated shiny poly on top (my test was with a rayon but I would really use Superior Rainbows on the quilt) and the Aurifil 50 in the bobbin again. The tension was about 3 and the stitches were about 1.5mm wide and long. I loved the look! So pretty in the coordinating colors around the circle edge.

What stitch have you used for your invisible applique? Have you found that the little holes close up in time? Also what needle size do you use for the invisible -- perhaps I am using too large a needle? I have not tried the blind hem stitch yet, perhaps I'd like that better. But right now I am leaning toward the very small blanket stitch in the shiny variegated colors.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Sun May 20, 2012 3:30 pm

Michelle, it took a while to get back to you (don't have to clean house when you quilt but you do have to go shop for food... :lol: ). I went ahead and did another stitchout of my invisible applique stitches because I wanted to see how invisible I could get them and then tell you what I had done.

So, on my Bernina 830, I used the invisible applique stitch #1331, stitch length .8, stitch width.9, tension .05 (although tension will vary depending on fabric, thread, etc.). My understanding (I called my friend at the Bernina dealership) is that the stitch on your Bernina 153 that is roughly equivalent to mine is called the vari-lock stitch and should be among the top ten stitches displayed on your machine.

I used a size 70 universal needle to do this and believe this gives the smallest hole. I think you could probably use a size 60 or 65 needle too. If you notice from the picture below, you can see a teeny bit of my Aurifil 2370 coming up into the YLI invisible thread, but my understanding is that this will disappear with the first wash. Yes, if I take my bifocals off and put my nose right up to the block, I can see the tiny bobbin stitches but you otherwise don't really see them. Since I made my circles exactly like you did (with the exception of having used double freezer paper to make the circle), I think they will puff up and you will see neither the top bite nor the tiny stitches from the bobbin (they will get covered up by the puffy circle. Since you probably are using various colors on the background where your circles are lying, I would choose a medium thread that blends among the background colors you are using. And if all else fails, Aurifil #2370 always seems to do the trick.

Let me know how it works out for you and if there is anyone else who would like to pipe up about the topic, please! I've never done invisible applique before so this may just have been a lucky day for me.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby heartnsoulquilts » Sun May 20, 2012 6:55 pm

Thanks so much Renata. Your circle looks wonderful! I will look up in my manual which is the vari-lock stitch and make another sample with that and a smaller needle also. And I'll lower the width and length a smidge too.

One of my samples was a yellow circle stitched to a black background... I am now wondering if the black fabric was shadowing up through the holes and that was why I didn't like the look. Or maybe my Aurifil was not a good color - I used a dark grey, perhaps I need a lighter color that is closer to the applique color for the bobbin, in case it shows in the hole. Later in the year, I will be appliqueing the four corner motifs (flower designs and large to small runs of circles) onto black so I do need to like the look. The earlier months are on other brighter colors for the backgrounds.

So many variables to consider! Thanks again for helping me out here!
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Tue May 29, 2012 9:27 am

This is an update on my experimentation with the Bernina 830 (but I hope it applies to other machines as well) and INVISIBLE THREAD for INVISIBLE APPLIQUE'.

Even though I could barely see the bobbin thread peeking through, that little bit still bothered me... :roll: I used stitch #1331 (manuals for some machines call it a vari-lock stitch or blind hemming stitch), stitch length .80 and stitch width .9. For thread, I put YLI Invisible thread in the top and Bottom Line in the bobbin. Top tension: 0, yes, zero! I also decided to go even smaller than before on my needle to a size 60. Pretty good results but I could still see a hair of the bobbin thread peeking through. I even played with the bobbin tension (because it is so easy to do in the 830) but to know avail... So, just before giving up totally, I threaded the bobbin for embroidery instead of regular sewing, adding a little bit of tension to the bobbin AND... drum roll.... the bobbin thread disappeared from the top and I now really have an invisible applique stitch.

My dealer had recommended not using the thread cutter with invisible thread or monopoly because many of her clients had a problem getting the thread stuck in the thread cutter and great difficulty getting it out... I followed her advice... only for a while... because I really missed the securing stitch I could program into my thread cutter, so I went back to using the thread cutter and have not had a problem at all.

Anyway, I am really happy now because my Sedona Star for Month Six will have prettier invisible stitching than Months Three through Five (I'm NOT ripping out the stitching on the previous work!) and thought I'd share this in the event it helped someone else.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby heartnsoulquilts » Tue May 29, 2012 3:39 pm

Renata thanks for the update.

When you say 'threaded the bobbin for embroidery instead of regular sewing' do you mean you threaded the bobbin thread through the pigtail hole? That would increase the bobbin tension, so the bobbin would pull the top thread more to the back. Which of course is what you want.

When I get the custom quilt off my frame, I will have some time to play with my invisible applique options. Thanks for your input!
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Tue May 29, 2012 3:51 pm

Michelle, that is exactly what I meant by threading for embroidery. The 830 threads differently than your machine because it has what I believe is an M bobbin, like mid-arms and long-arms (so I'm told). But your bobbin has the pigtail hole and that is exactly where the thread should go through to add just the right amount of tension (magic) to get rid of that shadow from the bobbin thread you still see in the small stitches popping up to the surface. I was totally flabbergasted this morning when I realized that's all it took to resolve the problem. In fact, when practicing FMQ with 50 or 60 wt thread, I often thread the bobbin for embroidery (piglet hole) and that is what gave me the idea to try it with invisible applique' stitches.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Sewdreamy » Tue May 29, 2012 4:34 pm

Renata, Thanks! Have you ever been able to use the dark monopoly thread on the Bernina? I tried it once right after I brought my 830 home and couldn't get him to sew with it, but I haven't tried lately now that I understand the machine better and I've learned a LOT.

I have been working on getting just the right balance on my metallic thread quilting for my perspectives quilt today. I wrote about my results on my personal blog: http://blog.bjfabricartist.com/ I really love the ability to control the bobbin tension so easily when we need to. It made all the difference, and I found I had to have a completely different set of settings when I used a silver Sulky thread and when I used a gold Superior.

Michelle, I'm still planning on making the BOM and haven't even started it yet, so you're ahead of me. :D :D
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby Renata » Tue May 29, 2012 5:44 pm

BJ, I have not tried the smoky Monopoly, but I might have a spool of smoky YLI in my thread stash, which I haven't used yet. I'll give it a try and let you know what I find out (always fun to play... :lol: ). I plan on buying Superior Monopoly just to try it out so I'll make sure to get both light and smoky and let you know.

I haven't had a problem with metallics yet but have not used them extensively either. I'll go to your blog and check out what you've got to say about the settings. I'm thinking about adding some metallics to my Sedona Star in Month 6. I have gold and silver in Superior, YLI and Yenmet to play with.
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Re: 830 and MonoPoly Thread

Postby heartnsoulquilts » Tue May 29, 2012 6:46 pm

Thanks Renata. My longarm has the M bobbin and I love it -- it holds so much thread!! But my Bernina 153QE has the standard Bernina bobbin with the pigtail bobbin case, so I will thread that pigtail and see what happens. Still plugging away at the 92 x 92 full custom quilt on my frame... hope to finish it tomorrow!

BJ, before you begin Sedona Star, take a few hours to read all the posts about it. There are lots of valuable tidbits and ideas and feedback and suggestions in the SS BOM forum. I jotted down some notes that were particularly helpful (like unfinished and finished sizes for Month 1's three rings and settings to try for invisible machine applique) and put them in my 3 ring binder where I keep each month's instructions. Reading the BOM forum posts have really helped me understand this sometimes challenging quilt making process better.
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